netchaplain
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The Christian life is not our living a life like Christ, but Christ living His life in us!
Posts: 206
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Post by netchaplain on Sept 19, 2022 13:16:20 GMT -8
Is the Covenant of Redemption a thing! Yes, and God is a bit mysterious concerning this one, for it is the one that is for those, whom, created after His image, are also after His “good pleasure” (Phl 2:13). These are they who are more precious to God than the angels; for man is the sole being who is after the image of God!
The present covenant of which the Christian is a recipient is a Covenant between the Father and His Son, in that the Father sacrificed the Son and raised Him from the dead after expiating the sins of the Christian (Heb 13:20, 21; Act 2:24, 32; 3:15; 4:10; 5:30; 10:40, 41; 13:30; 17:31; Rom 1:4; 4:24; 25; 8:11; 1Co 6:14, 15; 2Co 4:14; Gal 1:1; Eph 1:20; Col 2:12; 1Th 1:10; 1Pe 1:21).
In every covenant there is a benefactor and a beneficiary. If you’re in a covenant with God, He is the Benefactor, and you are the beneficiary; and you must be morally good to receive blessing; and not having a new nature presents the possibility of one returning to the “old man.” Being recipients of the Covenant between the Father and the Son we, by the Spirit using the new nature, are made to be good, so that there is no possible chance of returning to the “old man” (Phl 2:13). In the present Covenant the Benefactors are the Father and the Son, and the beneficiaries are the Christians!
We see the covenant language between God and Abraham, Isaac and Jacob (Lev 26:42), but there is no such language concerning the covenant with Christians. Just, "This is My body which is given for you," and "This cup is the new testament in My blood, which is shed for you" (Luk 22:19, 20); and that's all that’s necessary! No covenant between God and Christians, for He desired believers to be assured of desiring and doing His good pleasure.
There will be a New Covenant between God and the Israelites who “believe in God” (Jn 14:1) during the Millennium, after they finally see the Lord Jesus (Jer 31:31 Eze 36:24-28). I say finally, because “Jews require a sign” (Jhn 2:18; 1Co 1:22); and because Israel will not “believe” until they see Him, they forfeit the “blessing” of being in the Son-ship of Christ (Jn 20:29). Thus, they will remain a “people of God” (Heb 8:10); and Christians will be a people of God—but also sons and daughters of God, and “kings and priests” (Rev 21:3; 1:6; 5:10).
Note: I realize this is not plainly taught in Scripture, thus it is an inference; but it is a doctrine that I believe is not just theory but true, and I find it to be the most encouraging of all doctrines, it being the primary reason for creation.
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eleos
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God is Love.
Posts: 44
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Post by eleos on Sept 28, 2022 10:23:24 GMT -8
Debatable .... that Jesus at His return will rule on earth.
When Jesus returns the 1st resurrection happens ... according to Paul ... ALL the saved meet Him in the air.
1st Thessonlians 4
The Coming of the Lord
13 But we do not want you to be uninformed, brothers, about those who are asleep, that you may not grieve as others do who have no hope. 14 For since we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so, through Jesus, God will bring with him those who have fallen asleep. 15 For this we declare to you by a word from the Lord,[d] that we who are alive, who are left until the coming of the Lord, will not precede those who have fallen asleep.
16 For the Lord himself will descend from heaven with a cry of command, with the voice of an archangel, and with the sound of the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first. 17 Then we who are alive, who are left, will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air, and so we will always be with the Lord. 18 Therefore encourage one another with these words.
Matthew 24
Berean Standard Bible
And He will send out His angels with a loud trumpet call, and they will gather His elect from the four winds, from one end of the heavens to the other.
Judgement takes place in heaven before His return.
At His return Jesus does not come to deal with sin, “but to bring salvation to those who are waiting for him” (Heb. 9:28, NIV). At the return of Christ each one receives a reward that was apportioned to him or her according to what he or she has done in this life (Matt. 16:27)
The millennium is spent in heaven ... not on earth.
Jesus left the earthly temple desolate and it will remain so,
Jesus teaches there are no Jews ... we are all one in Him.
Galatians 3
Berean Standard Bible
There is neither Jew nor Greek, slave nor free, male nor female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus.
All the saved are His people ... it is not a "ethnic" thing ... it is ones spiritual condition no matter what one's ethnicity is.
When He returns then the saved go to where He is ... Where is He? He's in heaven.
"Don't be troubled. You trust God, now trust in me. There are many rooms in my Father's home, and I am going to prepare a place for you. If this were not so, I would tell you plainly. When everything is ready, I will come and get you, so that you will always be with me where I am." (NLT, John 14:1-4)
All (including the Jews) have the opportunity to come to Christ ... until He returns.
There is great destruction when He returns. Nobody can survive this ... those not taken to heaven will be destroyed.
But the day of the Lord will come as unexpectedly as a thief. Then the heavens will pass away with a terrible noise, and the very elements themselves will disappear in fire, and the earth and everything on it will be found to deserve judgment. Since everything around us is going to be destroyed like this, what holy and godly lives you should live, looking forward to the day of God and hurrying it along. On that day, he will set the heavens on fire, and the elements will melt away in the flames. But we are looking forward to the new heavens and new earth he has promised, a world filled with God’s righteousness. 2 Peter 3:10-13 NLT
There isn't a "second chance" ... TODAY (NOW) is the day of salvation.
2nd Corinthians 6:2
English Standard Version
For he says, “In a favorable time I listened to you, and in a day of salvation I have helped you.” Behold, now is the favorable time; behold, now is the day of salvation.
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netchaplain
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The Christian life is not our living a life like Christ, but Christ living His life in us!
Posts: 206
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Post by netchaplain on Sept 28, 2022 11:08:39 GMT -8
The millennium is spent in heaven ... not on earth. Hi, and thanks for your comments! The "bottomless pit" isn't in heaven, so must be in the earth; and those of the devil will be on the earth when He is loosed. Rev 20:8: And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea. There will be many saints on earth at this battle (attempted battle).9: And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them. |
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eleos
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God is Love.
Posts: 44
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Post by eleos on Sept 28, 2022 12:35:51 GMT -8
Didn't say the bottomless pit was heaven. What I said was that ALL the saved will be taken to heaven.
The expression ‘bottomless pit’ represents the earth in a state of confusion and darkness is evident from other scriptures.
Concerning the condition of the earth ‘in the beginning,’ the Bible record says that it ‘was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep’ (Genesis 1:2) [The Hebrew word here translated ‘deep’ is rendered in the Septuagint (Greek) translation of the Hebrew Old Testament by the same word rendered ‘bottomless pit’ in Revelation 20:1–3.]
Prophecy teaches that it will be brought back to this condition.
After Jesus returns .... it is NOT the full end. The 2nd resurrection (of the lost) happens 1,000 years later .... after satan is released
Since the righteous ascend to be with the Lord and the wicked are destroyed at His appearing, the earth stands for a time without human inhabitants. Jeremiah 4:23-25, NIV. "I looked at the earth, and it was formless and empty; and at the heavens, and their light was gone. I looked at the mountains, and they were quaking; all the hills were swaying. I looked, and there were no people; every bird in the sky had flown away."
The wicked remain in their graves for a thousand years. Revelation 20:4-5, NIV. "[God's people] came to life and reigned with Christ a thousand years. (The rest of the dead did not come to life until the thousand years were ended.)"
The battle of Gog and Magog is with the NEW Jerusalem that descends from heaven ... satan and his angels along with the resurrected dead attack the NEW Jerusalem that descends from heaven.
And when the thousand years are ended, Satan will be released from his prison and will come out to deceive the nations that are at the four corners of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them for battle; their number is like the sand of the sea.
God will destroy them ... the saints (the saved) are protected in the city (New Jerusalem). The saints don't fight this final battle .... God handles it all ... and yes ... all the lost (many of them) are as the sands of the sea.
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netchaplain
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The Christian life is not our living a life like Christ, but Christ living His life in us!
Posts: 206
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Post by netchaplain on Sept 29, 2022 5:48:01 GMT -8
Didn't say the bottomless pit was heaven. What I said was that ALL the saved will be taken to heaven. The expression ‘bottomless pit’ represents the earth in a state of confusion and darkness is evident from other scriptures. Concerning the condition of the earth ‘in the beginning,’ the Bible record says that it ‘was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep’ (Genesis 1:2) [The Hebrew word here translated ‘deep’ is rendered in the Septuagint (Greek) translation of the Hebrew Old Testament by the same word rendered ‘bottomless pit’ in Revelation 20:1–3.] Prophecy teaches that it will be brought back to this condition. After Jesus returns .... it is NOT the full end. The 2nd resurrection (of the lost) happens 1,000 years later .... after satan is released Since the righteous ascend to be with the Lord and the wicked are destroyed at His appearing, the earth stands for a time without human inhabitants. Jeremiah 4:23-25, NIV. "I looked at the earth, and it was formless and empty; and at the heavens, and their light was gone. I looked at the mountains, and they were quaking; all the hills were swaying. I looked, and there were no people; every bird in the sky had flown away." The wicked remain in their graves for a thousand years. Revelation 20:4-5, NIV. "[God's people] came to life and reigned with Christ a thousand years. (The rest of the dead did not come to life until the thousand years were ended.)" The battle of Gog and Magog is with the NEW Jerusalem that descends from heaven ... satan and his angels along with the resurrected dead attack the NEW Jerusalem that descends from heaven. And when the thousand years are ended, Satan will be released from his prison and will come out to deceive the nations that are at the four corners of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them for battle; their number is like the sand of the sea. God will destroy them ... the saints (the saved) are protected in the city (New Jerusalem). The saints don't fight this final battle .... God handles it all ... and yes ... all the lost (many of them) are as the sands of the sea. I didn't mean to say you said the bottomless pit was heaven, was just stating a truth; and I believe it's a literal place. Concerning Jeremiah 4:23-25, it's my understanding it was a vision. Yes, the lost will be many; the majority of mankind (Mat 7:13, 14). |
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eleos
New Member
God is Love.
Posts: 44
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Post by eleos on Sept 29, 2022 11:13:33 GMT -8
so .... where is this literal place located? If it is a literal place, who all is there are what are they doing? I "assume" it is a "place for the wicked" .... however ... in Revelation 20:4-5 it says "the wicked remain in their graves"
Ecclesiastes 9:10
New King James Version
Whatever your hand finds to do, do it with your might; for there is no work or device or knowledge or wisdom in the grave where you are going.
Tells us where we go when we die earthly death .... we go literally to the grave.
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eleos
New Member
God is Love.
Posts: 44
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Post by eleos on Sept 29, 2022 11:40:11 GMT -8
Didn't say the bottomless pit was heaven. What I said was that ALL the saved will be taken to heaven. The expression ‘bottomless pit’ represents the earth in a state of confusion and darkness is evident from other scriptures. Concerning the condition of the earth ‘in the beginning,’ the Bible record says that it ‘was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep’ (Genesis 1:2) [The Hebrew word here translated ‘deep’ is rendered in the Septuagint (Greek) translation of the Hebrew Old Testament by the same word rendered ‘bottomless pit’ in Revelation 20:1–3.] Prophecy teaches that it will be brought back to this condition. After Jesus returns .... it is NOT the full end. The 2nd resurrection (of the lost) happens 1,000 years later .... after satan is released Since the righteous ascend to be with the Lord and the wicked are destroyed at His appearing, the earth stands for a time without human inhabitants. Jeremiah 4:23-25, NIV. "I looked at the earth, and it was formless and empty; and at the heavens, and their light was gone. I looked at the mountains, and they were quaking; all the hills were swaying. I looked, and there were no people; every bird in the sky had flown away." The wicked remain in their graves for a thousand years. Revelation 20:4-5, NIV. "[God's people] came to life and reigned with Christ a thousand years. (The rest of the dead did not come to life until the thousand years were ended.)" The battle of Gog and Magog is with the NEW Jerusalem that descends from heaven ... satan and his angels along with the resurrected dead attack the NEW Jerusalem that descends from heaven. And when the thousand years are ended, Satan will be released from his prison and will come out to deceive the nations that are at the four corners of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them for battle; their number is like the sand of the sea. God will destroy them ... the saints (the saved) are protected in the city (New Jerusalem). The saints don't fight this final battle .... God handles it all ... and yes ... all the lost (many of them) are as the sands of the sea. I didn't mean to say you said the bottomless pit was heaven, was just stating a truth; and I believe it's a literal place. Concerning Jeremiah 4:23-25, it's my understanding it was a vision. Yes, the lost will be many; the majority of mankind (Mat 7:13, 14). well yes Jeremiah did have a vision .... a vision of the future of the state of the earth ... many were given visions of the future ... they certainly are not to be discounted or ignored. 2 Peter 1:19 King James Version 19 We have also a more sure word of prophecy; whereunto ye do well that ye take heed, as unto a light that shineth in a dark place, until the day dawn, and the day star arise in your hearts: |
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