netchaplain
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The Christian life is not our living a life like Christ, but Christ living His life in us!
Posts: 206
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Post by netchaplain on Nov 12, 2022 7:05:09 GMT -8
It is of the utmost importance, in the study of Scripture, to distinguish between God’s moral government of the world (esp. concerning Israel, still and will always be “God’s people”—NC), and the specific hope of the Church. The entire body of Old Testament prophecy, and much of the New, treats of the former, and in so doing, presents a subject of commanding interest to every Christian.
It is interesting to know what God is doing, and will do, in all the nations of the earth—interesting to read His thoughts about Tyre, Babylon, Nineveh and Jerusalem; about Egypt, Assyria and the land of Israel. In short, the entire range of OT prophecy demands the prayerful attention of every true believer. But, let it be remembered, we do not find therein contained the proper hope of the Church (only for Israel—NC).
How could we? If we have not there the Church’s (Christians—NC) existence directly revealed, how could we have the Church’s hope? Impossible. It is not that the Church cannot find there (among Israel—NC) a rich harvest of divine moral principles (e.g. the Decalogue—NC), which she may most happily and profitably use. She undoubtedly can; but this is quite another thing from finding there her proper existence and specific hope (new heaven instead of new earth—NC).
Yet, a large portion of the OT prophecies has been applied to the Church (which do not apply—NC); and this application has involved the whole subject in such a mist and confusion, that immature minds are turned away from the study (exegeses of Israel’s eschatology—NC). Hence in neglecting the study of prophecy (which most is of Israel, 90% of the Bible being Jewish centered—NC), they have also neglected that which is quite distinct from prophecy, properly so called—even the hope of the Church. Which hope, be it well remembered, is not anything which God is going to do with the nations of the earth, but to meet the Lord Jesus in the clouds of heaven, to be forever with Him and forever like Him.
Many may say, I have no head for prophecy. Perhaps not, but have you a heart for the Lord Jesus? Surely, if you love Him you will love His appearing, though you may have little or no capacity for prophetic investigation. An affectionate wife may not have a head for her husband’s business matters, but she has a heart for her husband’s return—she knows his footstep and recognizes his voice. The most unlettered saint, if only he has affection for the Person of the Lord Jesus, can entertain the most intense desire to see Him; and this is the Church’s hope.
Paul could say to the Thessalonians, “Ye turned to God from idols, to serve the living and true God, and to wait for His Son from heaven” (1Thes 1:9, 10). Now, evidently, those Thessalonian saints could, at the moment of their conversion, have known little, if anything, of prophecy, or the special subject thereof; and yet they were, at that very moment, put into the full possession and power of the specific hope of the Church (eternal life—NC)—even the coming of the Son.
Thus it is throughout the entire New Testament. There, no doubt, we have prophecy—there too, we have God’s moral government; but, at the same time, numberless passages might be adduced in proof of the fact, that the common hope of Christians in apostolic times—the simple, unimpeded and unencumbered hope—was, the return of the Bridegroom. May the Holy Spirit revive “that blessed hope” in the elect, and “make ready a people prepared for the Lord” (Tit 2:13; Luk 1:17).
—Charles Henry Mackintosh (1820-1896)
MJS daily devotional excerpt for Nov 12
“How much there is that is called spiritual that is but flesh! How many of the Lord’s people are seeking to touch the living God and fail to find Him and to satisfy their heart-hunger for true fellowship with Him. Theoretically we believe in His presence, but we find only a mere stirring of emotions. We are told of the Spirit’s power, but we see results produced by showmanship, oratory, and emotionalism. We are counseled to depend upon the Spirit, but in practice dependence is really on human wisdom, ability, personality and programs. We do not get through, behind all that is of man, to touch the living God.” -A.H. |
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Post by civic on Nov 12, 2022 16:12:28 GMT -8
I love the topic of the blessed hope
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netchaplain
Full Member
The Christian life is not our living a life like Christ, but Christ living His life in us!
Posts: 206
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Post by netchaplain on Nov 13, 2022 6:49:16 GMT -8
I love the topic of the blessed hope Hi, and thanks for letting me know you like it! God bless!! |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 13, 2022 8:32:52 GMT -8
It is of the utmost importance, in the study of Scripture, to distinguish between God’s moral government of the world (esp. concerning Israel, still and will always be “God’s people”—NC), and the specific hope of the Church. The entire body of Old Testament prophecy, and much of the New, treats of the former, and in so doing, presents a subject of commanding interest to every Christian.
It is interesting to know what God is doing, and will do, in all the nations of the earth—interesting to read His thoughts about Tyre, Babylon, Nineveh and Jerusalem; about Egypt, Assyria and the land of Israel. In short, the entire range of OT prophecy demands the prayerful attention of every true believer. But, let it be remembered, we do not find therein contained the proper hope of the Church (only for Israel—NC).
How could we? If we have not there the Church’s (Christians—NC) existence directly revealed, how could we have the Church’s hope? Impossible. It is not that the Church cannot find there (among Israel—NC) a rich harvest of divine moral principles (e.g. the Decalogue—NC), which she may most happily and profitably use. She undoubtedly can; but this is quite another thing from finding there her proper existence and specific hope (new heaven instead of new earth—NC).
Yet, a large portion of the OT prophecies has been applied to the Church (which do not apply—NC); and this application has involved the whole subject in such a mist and confusion, that immature minds are turned away from the study (exegeses of Israel’s eschatology—NC). Hence in neglecting the study of prophecy (which most is of Israel, 90% of the Bible being Jewish centered—NC), they have also neglected that which is quite distinct from prophecy, properly so called—even the hope of the Church. Which hope, be it well remembered, is not anything which God is going to do with the nations of the earth, but to meet the Lord Jesus in the clouds of heaven, to be forever with Him and forever like Him.
Many may say, I have no head for prophecy. Perhaps not, but have you a heart for the Lord Jesus? Surely, if you love Him you will love His appearing, though you may have little or no capacity for prophetic investigation. An affectionate wife may not have a head for her husband’s business matters, but she has a heart for her husband’s return—she knows his footstep and recognizes his voice. The most unlettered saint, if only he has affection for the Person of the Lord Jesus, can entertain the most intense desire to see Him; and this is the Church’s hope.
Paul could say to the Thessalonians, “Ye turned to God from idols, to serve the living and true God, and to wait for His Son from heaven” (1Thes 1:9, 10). Now, evidently, those Thessalonian saints could, at the moment of their conversion, have known little, if anything, of prophecy, or the special subject thereof; and yet they were, at that very moment, put into the full possession and power of the specific hope of the Church (eternal life—NC)—even the coming of the Son.
Thus it is throughout the entire New Testament. There, no doubt, we have prophecy—there too, we have God’s moral government; but, at the same time, numberless passages might be adduced in proof of the fact, that the common hope of Christians in apostolic times—the simple, unimpeded and unencumbered hope—was, the return of the Bridegroom. May the Holy Spirit revive “that blessed hope” in the elect, and “make ready a people prepared for the Lord” (Tit 2:13; Luk 1:17).
—Charles Henry Mackintosh (1820-1896)
MJS daily devotional excerpt for Nov 12
“How much there is that is called spiritual that is but flesh! How many of the Lord’s people are seeking to touch the living God and fail to find Him and to satisfy their heart-hunger for true fellowship with Him. Theoretically we believe in His presence, but we find only a mere stirring of emotions. We are told of the Spirit’s power, but we see results produced by showmanship, oratory, and emotionalism. We are counseled to depend upon the Spirit, but in practice dependence is really on human wisdom, ability, personality and programs. We do not get through, behind all that is of man, to touch the living God.” -A.H. What is "NC"? Is that a reference to NetChaplain and content you added to MacIntosh's message? What was " the blessed hope" of the Church prior to the 1800s when MacIntosh was preaching? Are you familiar with (have you read) the book, " The Blessed Hope," by George Eldon Ladd? Are you familiar with MacIntosh's ecclesiology and view of the Church? Are you aware none of the prediction he made came true? |
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Post by civic on Nov 13, 2022 8:48:09 GMT -8
It is of the utmost importance, in the study of Scripture, to distinguish between God’s moral government of the world (esp. concerning Israel, still and will always be “God’s people”—NC), and the specific hope of the Church. The entire body of Old Testament prophecy, and much of the New, treats of the former, and in so doing, presents a subject of commanding interest to every Christian.
It is interesting to know what God is doing, and will do, in all the nations of the earth—interesting to read His thoughts about Tyre, Babylon, Nineveh and Jerusalem; about Egypt, Assyria and the land of Israel. In short, the entire range of OT prophecy demands the prayerful attention of every true believer. But, let it be remembered, we do not find therein contained the proper hope of the Church (only for Israel—NC).
How could we? If we have not there the Church’s (Christians—NC) existence directly revealed, how could we have the Church’s hope? Impossible. It is not that the Church cannot find there (among Israel—NC) a rich harvest of divine moral principles (e.g. the Decalogue—NC), which she may most happily and profitably use. She undoubtedly can; but this is quite another thing from finding there her proper existence and specific hope (new heaven instead of new earth—NC).
Yet, a large portion of the OT prophecies has been applied to the Church (which do not apply—NC); and this application has involved the whole subject in such a mist and confusion, that immature minds are turned away from the study (exegeses of Israel’s eschatology—NC). Hence in neglecting the study of prophecy (which most is of Israel, 90% of the Bible being Jewish centered—NC), they have also neglected that which is quite distinct from prophecy, properly so called—even the hope of the Church. Which hope, be it well remembered, is not anything which God is going to do with the nations of the earth, but to meet the Lord Jesus in the clouds of heaven, to be forever with Him and forever like Him.
Many may say, I have no head for prophecy. Perhaps not, but have you a heart for the Lord Jesus? Surely, if you love Him you will love His appearing, though you may have little or no capacity for prophetic investigation. An affectionate wife may not have a head for her husband’s business matters, but she has a heart for her husband’s return—she knows his footstep and recognizes his voice. The most unlettered saint, if only he has affection for the Person of the Lord Jesus, can entertain the most intense desire to see Him; and this is the Church’s hope.
Paul could say to the Thessalonians, “Ye turned to God from idols, to serve the living and true God, and to wait for His Son from heaven” (1Thes 1:9, 10). Now, evidently, those Thessalonian saints could, at the moment of their conversion, have known little, if anything, of prophecy, or the special subject thereof; and yet they were, at that very moment, put into the full possession and power of the specific hope of the Church (eternal life—NC)—even the coming of the Son.
Thus it is throughout the entire New Testament. There, no doubt, we have prophecy—there too, we have God’s moral government; but, at the same time, numberless passages might be adduced in proof of the fact, that the common hope of Christians in apostolic times—the simple, unimpeded and unencumbered hope—was, the return of the Bridegroom. May the Holy Spirit revive “that blessed hope” in the elect, and “make ready a people prepared for the Lord” (Tit 2:13; Luk 1:17).
—Charles Henry Mackintosh (1820-1896)
MJS daily devotional excerpt for Nov 12
“How much there is that is called spiritual that is but flesh! How many of the Lord’s people are seeking to touch the living God and fail to find Him and to satisfy their heart-hunger for true fellowship with Him. Theoretically we believe in His presence, but we find only a mere stirring of emotions. We are told of the Spirit’s power, but we see results produced by showmanship, oratory, and emotionalism. We are counseled to depend upon the Spirit, but in practice dependence is really on human wisdom, ability, personality and programs. We do not get through, behind all that is of man, to touch the living God.” -A.H. What is "NC"? Is that a reference to NetChaplain and content you added to MacIntosh's message? What was " the blessed hope" of the Church prior to the 1800s when MacIntosh was preaching? Are you familiar with (have you read) the book, " The Blessed Hope," by George Eldon Ladd? Are you familiar with MacIntosh's ecclesiology and view of the Church? Are you aware none of the prediction he made came true? I really like Ladds book and bought it while I was an avid pre tribulationist debating it with everyone. But I did want to understand all the different views . I also like Clause on the meaning of the millennium. |
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netchaplain
Full Member
The Christian life is not our living a life like Christ, but Christ living His life in us!
Posts: 206
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Post by netchaplain on Nov 14, 2022 6:44:04 GMT -8
What is "NC"? Is that a reference to NetChaplain and content you added to MacIntosh's message? Yes, I want viewers to know when I comment, just to share what I think on issues. |
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Nov 14, 2022 6:52:58 GMT -8
What is "NC"? Is that a reference to NetChaplain and content you added to MacIntosh's message? What was " the blessed hope" of the Church prior to the 1800s when MacIntosh was preaching? Are you familiar with (have you read) the book, " The Blessed Hope," by George Eldon Ladd? Are you familiar with MacIntosh's ecclesiology and view of the Church? Are you aware none of the prediction he made came true? I really like Ladds book and bought it while I was an avid pre tribulationist debating it with everyone. But I did want to understand all the different views . I also like Clause on the meaning of the millennium. Both worth the read and very informative. What do you make of this op's MacIntosh article in comparison to Ladd? (you may not be familiar with Mac, but he was a Brethren who came to prominence during the restoration movement and ardent Dispensationalist) |
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JDS
New Member
Posts: 48
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Post by JDS on Nov 22, 2022 13:17:26 GMT -8
It is of the utmost importance, in the study of Scripture, to distinguish between God’s moral government of the world (esp. concerning Israel, still and will always be “God’s people”—NC), and the specific hope of the Church. The entire body of Old Testament prophecy, and much of the New, treats of the former, and in so doing, presents a subject of commanding interest to every Christian.
It is interesting to know what God is doing, and will do, in all the nations of the earth—interesting to read His thoughts about Tyre, Babylon, Nineveh and Jerusalem; about Egypt, Assyria and the land of Israel. In short, the entire range of OT prophecy demands the prayerful attention of every true believer. But, let it be remembered, we do not find therein contained the proper hope of the Church (only for Israel—NC).
How could we? If we have not there the Church’s (Christians—NC) existence directly revealed, how could we have the Church’s hope? Impossible. It is not that the Church cannot find there (among Israel—NC) a rich harvest of divine moral principles (e.g. the Decalogue—NC), which she may most happily and profitably use. She undoubtedly can; but this is quite another thing from finding there her proper existence and specific hope (new heaven instead of new earth—NC).
Yet, a large portion of the OT prophecies has been applied to the Church (which do not apply—NC); and this application has involved the whole subject in such a mist and confusion, that immature minds are turned away from the study (exegeses of Israel’s eschatology—NC). Hence in neglecting the study of prophecy (which most is of Israel, 90% of the Bible being Jewish centered—NC), they have also neglected that which is quite distinct from prophecy, properly so called—even the hope of the Church. Which hope, be it well remembered, is not anything which God is going to do with the nations of the earth, but to meet the Lord Jesus in the clouds of heaven, to be forever with Him and forever like Him.
Many may say, I have no head for prophecy. Perhaps not, but have you a heart for the Lord Jesus? Surely, if you love Him you will love His appearing, though you may have little or no capacity for prophetic investigation. An affectionate wife may not have a head for her husband’s business matters, but she has a heart for her husband’s return—she knows his footstep and recognizes his voice. The most unlettered saint, if only he has affection for the Person of the Lord Jesus, can entertain the most intense desire to see Him; and this is the Church’s hope.
Paul could say to the Thessalonians, “Ye turned to God from idols, to serve the living and true God, and to wait for His Son from heaven” (1Thes 1:9, 10). Now, evidently, those Thessalonian saints could, at the moment of their conversion, have known little, if anything, of prophecy, or the special subject thereof; and yet they were, at that very moment, put into the full possession and power of the specific hope of the Church (eternal life—NC)—even the coming of the Son.
Thus it is throughout the entire New Testament. There, no doubt, we have prophecy—there too, we have God’s moral government; but, at the same time, numberless passages might be adduced in proof of the fact, that the common hope of Christians in apostolic times—the simple, unimpeded and unencumbered hope—was, the return of the Bridegroom. May the Holy Spirit revive “that blessed hope” in the elect, and “make ready a people prepared for the Lord” (Tit 2:13; Luk 1:17).
—Charles Henry Mackintosh (1820-1896)
MJS daily devotional excerpt for Nov 12
“How much there is that is called spiritual that is but flesh! How many of the Lord’s people are seeking to touch the living God and fail to find Him and to satisfy their heart-hunger for true fellowship with Him. Theoretically we believe in His presence, but we find only a mere stirring of emotions. We are told of the Spirit’s power, but we see results produced by showmanship, oratory, and emotionalism. We are counseled to depend upon the Spirit, but in practice dependence is really on human wisdom, ability, personality and programs. We do not get through, behind all that is of man, to touch the living God.” -A.H. Faith and hope are a tandem. You cannot have one without the other. There are three great principles of this church age. Faith is the principle that must be in operation in the absence of full knowledge and understanding. Hope is the principle to which faith looks and anticipates. and without a promise that is received by faith there is no hope. Charity is the eternal principle that modifies all others and is the governing principle of God. Faith and hope are temporary and will come to an end when the perfect thing comes and at which time we will have full knowledge and are in the very presence of God. Partial knowledge is knowledge in part. Partial prophesy is the hope unfulfilled, but promised. It is prophesy in part. One has believed the prophesy of the translation by faith and now hopes for it because we love our Lord Jesus Christ. Here is the whole picture in one passage and shows charity as being greatest because it is eternal. 1 Cor 13:8 Charity never faileth: but whether there be prophecies, they shall fail; whether there be tongues, they shall cease; (end because they run out of energy) whether there be knowledge, it shall vanish away (because something external stopped it). 9 For we know in part, and we prophesy in part. 10 But when that which is perfect (the eternal state) is come, then that which is in part shall be done away. 11 When I was a child, I spake as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child: but when I became a man, I put away childish things. Coming up is a "now and then" verse. 12 For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face (when we have a glorified body at the translation of the church): now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known. 13 And now abideth faith, hope, charity, these three; but the greatest of these is charity. Faith and hope cannot enter into the "then." But charity can, and does. Rom 8:15 For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father. 23 And not only they, but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting for the adoption, to wit, the redemption of our body. 24 For we are saved by hope: but hope that is seen is not hope: for what a man seeth, why doth he yet hope for? 25 But if we hope for that we see not, then do we with patience wait for it. The blessed hope can only be experienced by a discerning Christian who understands that God has promised those to whom his Spirit has birthed into the family of God that the Spirit is the "earnest" of our salvation, which shall be complete when he gives each believer a new body at the translation of his collective glorious body the church, who is also his bride, and who he comes for before he cleanses the earth of all its rebels during the tribulation week that has been propesied by his men for years.. Titus 2:13 Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ; 14 Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works. 15 These things speak, and exhort, and rebuke with all authority. Let no man despise thee. There it is. The blessed hope defined as the glorious appearing to us of Christ to save us to the uttermost. Face to face with our saviour. Hope is over. Faith is passed. Charity remains. What a day! This is the predestination of the church of Jesus Christ. Col 1:24 Who now rejoice in my sufferings for you, and fill up that which is behind of the afflictions of Christ in my flesh for his body's sake, which is the church: 25 Whereof I am made a minister, according to the dispensation of God which is given to me for you, to fulfil the word of God; 26 Even the mystery which hath been hid from ages and from generations, but now is made manifest to his saints: 27 To whom God would make known what is the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles; which is Christ in you, the hope of glory: 28 Whom we preach, warning every man, and teaching every man in all wisdom; that we may present every man perfect in Christ Jesus: 29 Whereunto I also labour, striving according to his working, which worketh in me mightily. The apostle Paul, our apostle, the apostle to the gentiles, wants to make known to us the riches of what he calls this mystery. Two things, 1) Christ in you, and 2) the hope of glory. No man can teach anyone this mystery. God in the person of the Holy Spirit in us and the word of God is the only way we can know it. The fact that so many who profess Christ does not know this mystery, and even scoffs at it, gives me pause. I do like this Macintosh quote though. It is a blessing. |
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netchaplain
Full Member
The Christian life is not our living a life like Christ, but Christ living His life in us!
Posts: 206
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Post by netchaplain on Nov 22, 2022 14:31:17 GMT -8
Faith and hope are a tandem. You cannot have one without the other. There are three great principles of this church age. Faith is the principle that must be in operation in the absence of full knowledge and understanding. Hope is the principle to which faith looks and anticipates. and without a promise that is received by faith there is no hope. Amen; and its not a hopeful hope, but a knowing hope! Nice reply, thanks and God bless! |
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Post by civic on Nov 22, 2022 14:38:25 GMT -8
Faith and hope are a tandem. You cannot have one without the other. There are three great principles of this church age. Faith is the principle that must be in operation in the absence of full knowledge and understanding. Hope is the principle to which faith looks and anticipates. and without a promise that is received by faith there is no hope. Amen; and its not a hopeful hope, but a knowing hope! Nice reply, thanks and God bless! Yes indeed a secure hope like an anchor to our soul |
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Post by makesends on Nov 22, 2022 20:03:23 GMT -8
Amen; and its not a hopeful hope, but a knowing hope! Nice reply, thanks and God bless! Yes indeed a secure hope like an anchor to our soul Amen that, brothers. Just a remark here, not necessarily remarkable, but: The word translated into English as "hope", is in Spanish, "esperanza", which implies 'expectation', even 'anticipation'. I love it. It has been a long time since I studied it in the Greek, but from what I remember, the Greek is much the same. Certainly, the Biblical notion is more than just 'wishful thinking'! |
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netchaplain
Full Member
The Christian life is not our living a life like Christ, but Christ living His life in us!
Posts: 206
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Post by netchaplain on Nov 23, 2022 5:54:26 GMT -8
Yes indeed a secure hope like an anchor to our soul Amen that, brothers. Just a remark here, not necessarily remarkable, but: The word translated into English as "hope", is in Spanish, "esperanza", which implies 'expectation', even 'anticipation'. I love it. It has been a long time since I studied it in the Greek, but from what I remember, the Greek is much the same. Certainly, the Biblical notion is more than just 'wishful thinking'! Yes, this type of hope is one that is certain concerning anything that will come to pass. |
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