netchaplain
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The Christian life is not our living a life like Christ, but Christ living His life in us!
Posts: 206
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Post by netchaplain on Aug 8, 2023 13:58:15 GMT -8
Does God need to repeatedly forgive His children? What would such a need be, seeing He knows all we desire is to please Him; and this He assures (Phl 2:13). There is allowance for babes in Christ, who may yet have a habitual sin to give up, but He eventually brings all to the same knowledge, understanding and application concerning willful sins. If one does not eventually mature enough in Christ, it manifests yet to be reborn.
The sins of Christians eventually become more in the way of impulse, like wrath, jealousy, envy, selfish- pride, etc. which are sins that are not intentional, “presumptuous” (Num 15:30) or “willingly” (Heb 10:25). These spring up out of the moment and are not planned or intended. When believers sin unwillingly they confess, i.e. admit the wrong, or the Spirit will continue to convict until you confess, because now you belong to God, and He will not let you go your own way anymore. We confess, then thank God for His continued forgiveness.
It’s not that God has to go in and out of forgiveness, but it’s a need-only-once application during the initial confession of our salvation—from there on He will always be “faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness” (1Jn 1:9). Otherwise this would mean He has to keep repeating His cleansing from our sins, which is not necessary; same principle as being forgiven “once for all (Heb 10:10). Let’s not forget that “by one offering He hath perfected forever them that are sanctified” (Heb 10:14).
Our sanctification has to do with no longer being part of the “carnal mind,” nor part of the “flesh” (Rom 8:7, 9). God only sees the believer in Him and His Son, never again after the “old man” (flesh).
The Lord’s Prayer was to the Jew under the Law, which was forgiving to be forgiven. Now, it’s always forgive, and love as He loved, which is different from love according to how you love yourself.
We are never out of His forgiveness, any more than we are ever out of His love in Christ!
God be blessed!
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Post by charismaticlady on Aug 8, 2023 17:03:35 GMT -8
Does God need to repeatedly forgive His children? What would such a need be, seeing He knows all we desire is to please Him; and this He assures (Phl 2:13). There is allowance for babes in Christ, who may yet have a habitual sin to give up, but He eventually brings all to the same knowledge, understanding and application concerning willful sins. If one does not eventually mature enough in Christ, it manifests yet to be reborn. The sins of Christians eventually become more in the way of impulse, like wrath, jealousy, envy, selfish- pride, etc. which are sins that are not intentional, “presumptuous” (Num 15:30) or “willingly” (Heb 10:25). These spring up out of the moment and are not planned or intended. When believers sin unwillingly they confess, i.e. admit the wrong, or the Spirit will continue to convict until you confess, because now you belong to God, and He will not let you go your own way anymore. We confess, then thank God for His continued forgiveness. It’s not that God has to go in and out of forgiveness, but it’s a need-only-once application during the initial confession of our salvation—from there on He will always be “faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness” (1Jn 1:9). Otherwise this would mean He has to keep repeating His cleansing from our sins, which is not necessary; same principle as being forgiven “once for all (Heb 10:10). Let’s not forget that “by one offering He hath perfected forever them that are sanctified” (Heb 10:14). Our sanctification has to do with no longer being part of the “carnal mind,” nor part of the “flesh” (Rom 8:7, 9). God only sees the believer in Him and His Son, never again after the “old man” (flesh). The Lord’s Prayer was to the Jew under the Law, which was forgiving to be forgiven. Now, it’s always forgive, and love as He loved, which is different from love according to how you love yourself. We are never out of His forgiveness, any more than we are ever out of His love in Christ! God be blessed! I agree with this post as far as John has said in 1 John 1:7, but I still have a problem with some of the individual sins you keep quoting as a normal impulse of human nature, except possibly for a very young Christian, as they just cannot be committed while walking in the Spirit, because they are in fact identified as sins that will keep us out of the Kingdom of God. (Maybe it is more normal for those with testosterone. LOL) How long do you surmise that wrath, jealousy, and envy with a cycle of sin, repent, sin, repent, sin, repent go on and still show evidence that the Spirit is actually in control? These cannot be entirely unintentional. 1 John 1:7 7 But if we walk in the light as He is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus Christ His Son cleanses us from all sin. Galatians 5:19-21 19 Now the works of the flesh are evident, which are: adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lewdness, 20 idolatry, sorcery, hatred, contentions, jealousies, outbursts of wrath, selfish ambitions, dissensions, heresies, 21 envy, murders, drunkenness, revelries, and the like; of which I tell you beforehand, just as I also told you in time past, that those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God. |
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netchaplain
Full Member
The Christian life is not our living a life like Christ, but Christ living His life in us!
Posts: 206
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Post by netchaplain on Aug 9, 2023 5:15:18 GMT -8
I agree with this post as far as John has said in 1 John 1:7, but I still have a problem with some of the individual sins you keep quoting as a normal impulse of human nature, except possibly for a very young Christian, as they just cannot be committed while walking in the Spirit, When John wrote that we "cannot sin" it is in reference to desiring after sin, sinning "willfully" (Heb 10:26) or "presumptuously" (Num 15:28, 30). The sins of one reborn are never intentional. What believer would ever want to purposely offend God? The whole point is that the "old man" can no longer cause us to desire to sin (Ro 6:14; 8:9). I believe God left the old man (sin nature) in us to continue to learn from it, by exercising our faith in His forgiveness. Please give Gill a test-read on 1Jn 3: 1 John 3 Bible Commentary - John Gill’s Exposition of the Bible |
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netchaplain
Full Member
The Christian life is not our living a life like Christ, but Christ living His life in us!
Posts: 206
|
Post by netchaplain on Aug 9, 2023 5:26:47 GMT -8
When John wrote that we "cannot sin" it is in reference to desiring after sin, sinning "willfully" (Heb 10:26) or "presumptuously" (Num 15:28, 30). The sins of one reborn are never intentional. What believer would ever want to purposely offend God? The whole point is that the "old man" can no longer cause us to desire to sin (Ro 6:14; 8:9). I believe God left the old man (sin nature) in us to continue to learn from it, by exercising our faith in His forgiveness. Please give Gill a test-read on 1Jn 3: www.christianity.com/bible/commentary/john-gill/1-john/3 |
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Post by charismaticlady on Aug 9, 2023 20:00:40 GMT -8
I agree with this post as far as John has said in 1 John 1:7, but I still have a problem with some of the individual sins you keep quoting as a normal impulse of human nature, except possibly for a very young Christian, as they just cannot be committed while walking in the Spirit, When John wrote that we "cannot sin" it is in reference to desiring after sin, sinning "willfully" (Heb 10:26) or "presumptuously" (Num 15:28, 30). The sins of one reborn are never intentional. What believer would ever want to purposely offend God? The whole point is that the "old man" can no longer cause us to desire to sin (Ro 6:14; 8:9). I believe God left the old man (sin nature) in us to continue to learn from it, by exercising our faith in His forgiveness. Please give Gill a test-read on 1Jn 3: 1 John 3 Bible Commentary - John Gill’s Exposition of the Bible
The "old man" IS the sin nature. It is dead, nailed to the cross. I agree that a born again of the Spirit Christian cannot willfully sin, but I also know that Satan's influence over me is dead too, because Jesus destroyed it! 1 John 5:18. I think I already told you that when I was born again of the Spirit I actually felt the sin nature leave my body. It was a heaviness, and once gone I felt light as a feather and all desire to sin was gone. I only wanted to study about God and haven't stopped. That's 46 years and going strong.
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netchaplain
Full Member
The Christian life is not our living a life like Christ, but Christ living His life in us!
Posts: 206
|
Post by netchaplain on Oct 30, 2023 11:41:13 GMT -8
When John wrote that we "cannot sin" it is in reference to desiring after sin, sinning "willfully" (Heb 10:26) or "presumptuously" (Num 15:28, 30). The sins of one reborn are never intentional. What believer would ever want to purposely offend God? The whole point is that the "old man" can no longer cause us to desire to sin (Ro 6:14; 8:9). I believe God left the old man (sin nature) in us to continue to learn from it, by exercising our faith in His forgiveness. Please give Gill a test-read on 1Jn 3: 1 John 3 Bible Commentary - John Gill’s Exposition of the Bible
The "old man" IS the sin nature. It is dead, nailed to the cross. I agree that a born again of the Spirit Christian cannot willfully sin, but I also know that Satan's influence over me is dead too, because Jesus destroyed it! 1 John 5:18. I think I already told you that when I was born again of the Spirit I actually felt the sin nature leave my body. It was a heaviness, and once gone I felt light as a feather and all desire to sin was gone. I only wanted to study about God and haven't stopped. That's 46 years and going strong.
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netchaplain
Full Member
The Christian life is not our living a life like Christ, but Christ living His life in us!
Posts: 206
|
Post by netchaplain on Oct 30, 2023 11:46:02 GMT -8
The "old man" IS the sin nature. It is dead, nailed to the cross. I agree that a born again of the Spirit Christian cannot willfully sin, but I also know that Satan's influence over me is dead too, because Jesus destroyed it! 1 John 5:18. I think I already told you that when I was born again of the Spirit I actually felt the sin nature leave my body. It was a heaviness, and once gone I felt light as a feather and all desire to sin was gone. I only wanted to study about God and haven't stopped. That's 46 years and going strong.
It would be like the next life if we could be rid of the old man (sin nature). I know one thing for sure that left you at rebirth--the "dominion" of sin (Ro 6:14). The old man can no longer cause you to want to sin; and God guaranties it (Phl 2:13). Paul said it was his old man that now sins, and not himself as the new man (Ro 7 17, 20). Thanks for your reply Sis! |
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