The Tri-Unity of God in the Atonement and Jesus last words

Though often taught from the pulpit and widely accepted within Christianity, there is a common misnomer that God cannot look upon sin.

This misnomer or idea is rooted in a misunderstanding of Habakkuk 1:13, which states, "Your eyes are too pure to look upon evil." To expand upon the meaning of this verse, God cannot look at sin favorably or with complacency. However, this verse does not state that God cannot look at sin or that He cannot allow sin in His presence. God did not turn His back on Adam when he sinned--God sought him out. God did not turn His back on David when he sinned. In the book of Job, God allowed satan in His presence for a specific purpose. Satan wanted to make a deal with God over His servant, Job. God restricted Satan, telling him that he "can do anything but touch Job" and not to "lay a hand or finger on him." In the wilderness, Jesus allowed the presence of satan (face to face).

Jesus did not turn His back on Saul when he was persecuting the church and sought him out on the Damascus Road and said to him," why are you persecuting Me?" If God did not turn His back on sinners, then neither did the Father turn His back on His only Son who is Holy, Blameless, Sinless, and Righteous just like His Father. The Father turning His back on the Son (at the cross) is not found in Scripture. Jesus ate with sinners, lived among sinners, loves sinners and He suffered and died for sinners.


Wrath- strongs 3709 ὀργή is defined in the Greek lexicon as anger, retribution, vengeance, and indignation. God is not against Himself angrily displaying wrath from the Father to the Son. God is love. In love, He sent His Son. The wrath bearing Son is a new concept not found in Scripture nor the early church fathers (ECFs). God is not against Himself. No one in the Trinity is in opposition, no conflict, no dissension, no strife, no disunity, no dysfunction. As if God were somehow like a sinful human family. There is nothing broken in Our Blessed Trinity.

Jesus bearing God’s wrath and being despised and forsaken by the Father and Him turning His back on the Son is not found in the pages of Scripture. That doctrine was developed in the dark ages during the Reformation and called Penal Substitution Theory of the Atonement or PSA.

Calvin's comments on Galatians 3:13,

"He could not cease to be the object of his Father’s love, and yet he endured his wrath. For how could he reconcile the Father to us, if he had incurred his hatred and displeasure? We conclude, that he “did always those things that pleased” (John 8:29) his Father. Again, how would he have freed us from the wrath of God, if he had not transferred it from us to himself? Thus, “he was wounded for our transgressions,” (Isaiah 53:5,) and had to deal with God as an angry judge."


The following scriptures affirm that Jesus' relationship with the Father on the cross was still there and not broken.

Psalm 22:24
For he has not despised or scorned
the suffering of the afflicted one;
he has not hidden his face from him
but has listened to his cry for help.

Luke 23:46
Jesus called out with a loud voice, "Father, into your hands I commit my spirit." When he had said this, he breathed his last.

John 16:32
"A time is coming and in fact has come when you will be scattered, each to your own home. You will leave me all alone. Yet I am not alone, for my Father is with me."

Hebrews 5:7
During the days of Jesus’ life on earth, he offered up prayers and petitions with fervent cries and tears to the one who could save him from death, and he was heard because of his reverent submission.

Jesus' promise to the thief on the cross that today you will be with Me in Paradise reaffirms Jesus went to be with the Father and not suffer in hell as some teach.


In Matthew 26:39, Jesus says, "If it be your will, let this cup pass from me." Jesus tells us precisely what the cup was. It was the cup of his suffering, which meant that He would die an agonizing death as a martyr. In the passage below, Jesus told His disciples that they would also drink of the same "cup":

Matthew 20:17-

Now Jesus was going up to Jerusalem. On the way, he took the Twelve aside and said to them, 18 “We are going up to Jerusalem, and the Son of Man will be delivered over to the chief priests and the teachers of the law. They will condemn him to death 19 and will hand him over to the Gentiles to be mocked and flogged and crucified. On the third day he will be raised to life!”20 Then the mother of Zebedee’s sons came to Jesus with her sons and, kneeling down, asked a favor of him. 21 “What is it you want?” he asked. She said, "Grant that one of these two sons of mine may sit at your right and the other at your left in your kingdom."22 “You don’t know what you are asking,” Jesus said to them. “Can you drink the cup I am going to drink?” “We can,” they answered. 23 Jesus said to them, “You will indeed drink from my cup, but to sit at my right or left is not for me to grant. These places belong to those for whom they have been prepared by my Father.”

1 Thessalonians 5:9-For God did not appoint us to suffer wrath but to receive salvation through our Lord Jesus Christ.

As we see above it was not the cup of wrath Jesus was speaking about but it was the suffering He was going to have to endure for our sins. God has not appointed us to wrath and the cup means the suffering of Jesus and that the disciples would also suffer death as martyrs. In fact, many scriptures testify that believers too will suffer persecution for being a follower of Jesus. Suffering persecution is a promise for a believer who follows Jesus, it is something we should expect to happen in our life.

2 Timothy 3:12- Yes, and everyone who wants to live a godly life in Christ Jesus will suffer persecution.

John 15:20
Remember the word that I spoke to you: 'No servant is greater than his master.' If they persecuted Me, they will persecute you as well; if they kept My word, they will keep yours as well.

Matthew 5:10 - Blessed are those who are persecuted because of righteousness, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.

2 Corinthians 4:9- persecuted, but not forsaken; struck down, but not destroyed.

Wrath from God is not required for the forgiveness of sins, that is a misnomer.

Exodus 34:6
Then the LORD passed by in front of him and proclaimed, “The LORD, the LORD God, compassionate and merciful, slow to anger, and abounding in faithfulness and truth;

Isaiah 48:9
For the sake of My name, I will delay My wrath; for the sake of My praise, I will restrain it, so that you will not be cut off.

Psalm 78:38
And yet He was compassionate; He forgave their iniquity and did not destroy them. He often restrained His anger and did not unleash His full wrath.

Psalm 85:1-3
You, Lord, showed favor to your land;
you restored the fortunes of Jacob.
2 You forgave the iniquity of your people
and covered all their sins.
3 You set aside all your wrath
and turned from your fierce anger.

The wrath of God (Isaiah 53)


Matthew 8:14-17
When Jesus came into Peter’s home, He saw his mother-in-law lying sick in bed with a fever. 15 And He touched her hand, and the fever left her; and she got up and waited on Him. 16 Now when evening came, they brought to Him many who were demon-possessed; and He cast out the spirits with a word, and healed all who were ill. 17 This happened so that what was spoken through Isaiah the prophet would be fulfilled: “He Himself took our illnesses and carried away our diseases.”

Mark 15:27-32
They *crucified two robbers with Him, one on His right and one on His left. 28 And the Scripture was fulfilled which says, “And He was numbered with transgressors.”] 29 Those passing by were hurling abuse at Him, wagging their heads, and saying, “Ha! You who are going to destroy the temple and rebuild it in three days, 30 save Yourself, and come down from the cross!” 31 In the same way the chief priests also, along with the scribes, were mocking Him among themselves and saying, “He saved others; He cannot save Himself. 32 Let this Christ, the King of Israel, now come down from the cross, so that we may see and believe!” Those who were crucified with Him were also insulting Him.

Luke 22:35-38
And He said to them, “When I sent you out without money belt and bag and sandals, you did not lack anything, did you?” They said, “No, nothing.” 36 And He said to them, “But now, whoever has a money belt is to take it along, likewise also a bag, and whoever has no sword is to sell his cloak and buy one. 37 For I tell you that this which is written must be fulfilled in Me: ‘And He was counted with wrongdoers’; for that which refers to Me has its fulfillment.” 38 They said, “Lord, look, here are two swords.” And He said to them, “It is enough.”


John 12:37-41
But though He had performed so many signs in their sight, they still were not believing in Him. 38 This happened so that the word of Isaiah the prophet which he spoke would be fulfilled: “Lord, who has believed our report? And to whom has the arm of the Lord been revealed?” 39 For this reason they could not believe, for Isaiah said again, 40 “He has blinded their eyes and He hardened their heart, so that they will not see with their eyes and understand with their heart, and be converted, and so I will not heal them.” 41 These things Isaiah said because he saw His glory, and he spoke about Him.


Acts 8:26-35
But an angel of the Lord spoke to Philip, saying, “Get ready and go south to the road that descends from Jerusalem to Gaza.” (This is a desert road.) 27 So he got ready and went; and there was an Ethiopian eunuch, a court official of Candace, queen of the Ethiopians, who was in charge of all her treasure; and he had come to Jerusalem to worship, 28 and he was returning and sitting in his chariot, and was reading Isaiah the prophet. 29 Then the Spirit said to Philip, “Go up and join this chariot.” 30 Philip ran up and heard him reading Isaiah the prophet and said, "Do you understand what you are reading?” 31 And he said, “Well, how could I, unless someone guides me?” And he invited Philip to come up and sit with him. 32 Now the passage of Scripture which he was reading was this:
“He was led like a sheep to slaughter;
And like a lamb that is silent before its shearer,
So He does not open His mouth.
33 In humiliation His justice was taken away;
Who will describe His generation?
For His life is taken away from the earth.”
34 The eunuch answered Philip and said, “Please tell me, of whom does the prophet say this? Of himself, or of someone else?” 35 Then Philip opened his mouth, and beginning from this Scripture he preached Jesus to him.


Romans 10:11-21
For the Scripture says, “Whoever believes in Him will not be put to shame.” 12 For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek; for the same Lord is Lord of all, abounding in riches for all who call on Him; 13 for “Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.”14 How then are they to call on Him in whom they have not believed? How are they to believe in Him whom they have not heard? And how are they to hear without a preacher? 15 But how are they to preach unless they are sent? Just as it is written: “How beautiful are the feet of those who bring good news of good things!” 16 However, they did not all heed the good news; for Isaiah says, “Lord, who has believed our report?” 17 So faith comes from hearing, and hearing by the word of Christ.18 But I say, surely, they have never heard, have they? On the contrary:
“Their voice has gone out into all the earth, and their words to the ends of the world.” 19 But I say, surely Israel did not know, did they? First Moses says, “I will make you jealous with those who are not a nation, with a foolish nation I will anger you.” 20 And Isaiah is very bold and says, “I was found by those who did not seek Me, I revealed Myself to those who did not ask for Me.” 21 But as for Israel, He says, “I have spread out My hands all day long to a disobedient and obstinate people.”

1 Peter 2:19-25
For this finds favor, if for the sake of conscience toward God a person endures grief when suffering unjustly. 20 For what credit is there if, when you sin and are harshly treated, you endure it with patience? But if when you do what is right and suffer for it you patiently endure it, this finds favor with God 21 For you have been called for this purpose, because Christ also suffered for you, leaving you an example, so that you would follow in His steps, 22 He who committed no sin, nor was any deceit found in His mouth; 23 and while being abusively insulted, He did not insult in return; while suffering, He did not threaten, but kept entrusting Himself to Him who judges righteously; 24 and He Himself brought our sins in His body up on the cross, so that we might die to sin and live for righteousness; by His wounds you were healed. 25 For you were continually straying like sheep, but now you have returned to the Shepherd and Guardian of your souls.

I'm glad you enjoyed my study on the topic , I have been researching this since 2015. I might try and turn this into a book if I get the motivation. I have allot more to add within each topic in this OP. 

Addressing the OP. and haven't read all the post. not saying that any are right or wrong but consider this. Is God’s wrath punishing us?  ... I say NO, God is not directly punishing us, rather it’s us suffering the consequences of our actions. We often think of God’s wrath as something extra, an additional punishment. We sin, we suffer the consequence of our sin, and then God’s wrath really gives us what we deserve. But, but, but, and that's with one t, BUT thank God himself for dying on the cross for us. and separating from the body of corruption into a glorious body as we also shall do, which bring me to the next part of the question of God forsaking the son on the cross.  
“The forsaking of the Son”
(The Office of the Holy Spirit Revealed)


The question is asked, did God forsake the son on the cross, or separate from the son.the answer, NO. as a matter of fact, when Jesus said that it is finished, yes, on Sin in the world, but the glory and, the wonderful work of God, just began. and that work, after preaching to the spirits in prison, then the day of Pentecost the Holy Ghost is shed forth.



This, "of God forsaking the son", is borne out in Isaiah chapter 59, read this chapter good. the word forsaking, (forsook), means leave. here, the present of the Father, (the Spirit at baptism), in that body, (which is Christ), came out of the son, because the sins of the whole world will be laid on him. This word forsook is interesting. Forsook, or forsaking is the act of, or the allowing of one to be sacrifice. Note, to clearly see this, another word, or some synonyms words for forsook is, renounced, relinquished, “sacrificed”. Sacrificed is the word we are looking for. For the Lord God did provide himself a sacrifice, (the lamb of God). Genesis 22:8 "And Abraham said, My son, God will provide himself a lamb for a burnt offering: so they went both of them together”. And who is this Lamb? God himself, yes, the ordinal Last, shared in flesh. John 1:29 "The next day John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world". John 1:35 "Again the next day after John stood, and two of his disciples; 36 And looking upon Jesus as he walked, he saith, Behold the Lamb of God!"



this is borne out in Hebrews 9:26. "For then must he often have suffered since the foundation of the world: but now once in the end of the world hath he appeared to put away sin by the sacrifice of himself”. God the Spirit cannot dwell in an unclean place, and the scripture is clear, God will never forsake you, nor leave you, read Hebrews 13:15. and reading the whole chapter of Isa 59, (the entire book is worth reading), Jesus the lamb of God, (this body), was made/design to suffer, even the death of the cross, hence the “sacrifice”. Philippians 2:5 " Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus: 6 Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God: 7 But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men: 8 And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross". And upon that death, it released, or relinquish, (that's what forsook means also relinquish), the full power and attributes of God in human form. Glory to God/the Lord Jesus, (remember with blood he was G2758 κενόω kenoo, Limited, per Phil 2:7). but now, No more blood, (which is the first death), to hinder the Power of God, (in that natural body, hence the change). now the same eternal Spirit, that is, and was, and is now to come, the Holy Spirit, is Glorified in that form, that figure, that fashion as a man. now Jesus/God/Spirit is fully diverse in heaven as well as on earth. 1 Corinthians 12:4 "Now there are diversities of gifts, but the same Spirit". in his final administration, this process of forsook was to give us the same power he had, WITHOUT MEASURE, (which answered the “Greater than I question, because he goes to the Father/Spirit/the Ordinal First in which he was glorified in John 17:3. that's why we have the ministering Gifts or as some say the fivefold ministries, all because of his, "forsaking" on the cross in order to release all the power of God in human fashion. supportive scripture, Matthew 28:18 "And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth." as the apostle Peter said, acts 2:32 "This Jesus hath God raised up, whereof we all are witnesses. 33 Therefore being by the right hand of God exalted, and having received of the Father the promise of the Holy Ghost, he hath shed forth this, which ye now see and hear". all credit to the "forsaking" on the cross, we now have what he has, "POWER". which takes us to the last dispensation of GRACE. the preaching of the Gospel. the ongoing work of the ministry, world redemption.



for this "forsaking of the Son", on the cross, the "sacrifice”, without it, we wouldn't be able to preach the Gospel, nor help in restoring the temple of God, which is another topic in itself. 1 Corinthians 1:18 "For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God."



so the forsaking here is not an abandonment, nor a leaving, but the beginning of a recovery or restoration plan, starting with the spirits in prison. this rescue, or might as well say it, this plan of salvation started ...... yes, right there on the cross with the relinquishing of the FULL POWER of God in human form. the relinquishing or the "forsaking" was voluntarily, it was God's plan all along. God in Flesh Isaiah chapter 53, God’s own ARM brought salvation unto himself. see Isaiah 63:5.

It's amazing how the bible come full circle.

hope this helped someone in reading this post/

PICJAG, 101G.



Thanks for replying 101. This forum isn’t to debate the truth of the Trinity as we now have a debate section with Unitarianism and Modalism for those discussions. I hope you understand and you know I love those discussions . So we now have an appropriate board for those discussions to take place . Please feel free to tag me in any discussion over there my friend

Death 

I believe it was physical death was the consequence of adams sin. Death was a consequence of the fall. Sin brought forth death. 

Joe how are things going ?